Time to nerf Dragon's Curse Campaign?

Hi all,

Due to the population seems to be decreasing over the summer would it be worth to nerf some of the encounters that can't be done as a group such as Chapter 5 and 7?

I'm just worried that we're get to a point where we're continue to get less numbers every night and people will miss out on aurulite and getting their chapters done for Dragon's Curse.

Just a thought!
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  • I hate the cursed and ow campaigns and would be ok if they were deleted! Give me toa and si updates!
  • I hate the cursed and ow campaigns and would be ok if they were deleted! Give me toa and si updates!

    Would love it if we could go back to farming stuff as groups and roll on loot etc. These Campaigns have been disappointing and just isn't fun for anybody. We need funner content and going back and looking at old school PvE is your best bet for this dying game atm.
  • or just update the loot tables on ML 10 boss, Galladoria etc. Far more fun than what we got atm.
  • I agree and i think bs should listen to the games pve king! I think they can find a balance between difficulty and time needed to complete one.
  • Negative highly highly disagree. OW has already been nerfed with only [Curse] left as they only real Campaign left in the game. With the rvr currrency/crafting coming online the gear will be readily available to everyone, so again no reason to touch the Campaign.

    For context I'd just like to point out @Solicfear1 Hib has had more campaigns led then Albion plus Mid combined. Also Hib has some of the most OP'd for PVE and easiest combination of groups to PVE on. Kinda makes you wonder.

    GL
  • They said specifically that the other paths to get gear would be slower... so if nobody ends up doing the Curse raids, all we are left with is whatever the slow alternative is...?
  • Fateboi wrote: »
    Negative highly highly disagree. OW has already been nerfed with only [Curse] left as they only real Campaign left in the game. With the rvr currrency/crafting coming online the gear will be readily available to everyone, so again no reason to touch the Campaign.

    For context I'd just like to point out @Solicfear1 Hib has had more campaigns led then Albion plus Mid combined. Also Hib has some of the most OP'd for PVE and easiest combination of groups to PVE on. Kinda makes you wonder.

    GL

    I slightly disagree. Yes, OW was nerfed and the result is that it's easier to get the majority of it done with smaller numbers which is good for the dwindled population. Except for Chapter 7 and Chapter 10 of OW, the majority of it can be done with less than a group which makes it easier to get done for items commonly found in templates. That is important because in todays game where you don't see tons of OW raids across the realms people are still able to get they gear. This needs to be applied to the Curse campaign. Curse campaigns are limited across the realms and sometimes you have classes that aren't PVE friendly that need to go through them. Toning them down to the OW levels in terms of difficulty is only natural to better reflect the current population. At it's current difficulty level I believe more people would naturally gravitate to the BP alternative to obtain this gear than the PVE route due to the amount of players required to get past the back half of the quest series. Keeping it at such a difficult level will lead to its death.
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  • Sovereign wrote: »
    Fateboi wrote: »
    Negative highly highly disagree. OW has already been nerfed with only [Curse] left as they only real Campaign left in the game. With the rvr currrency/crafting coming online the gear will be readily available to everyone, so again no reason to touch the Campaign.

    For context I'd just like to point out @Solicfear1 Hib has had more campaigns led then Albion plus Mid combined. Also Hib has some of the most OP'd for PVE and easiest combination of groups to PVE on. Kinda makes you wonder.

    GL

    I slightly disagree. Yes, OW was nerfed and the result is that it's easier to get the majority of it done with smaller numbers which is good for the dwindled population. Except for Chapter 7 and Chapter 10 of OW, the majority of it can be done with less than a group which makes it easier to get done for items commonly found in templates. That is important because in todays game where you don't see tons of OW raids across the realms people are still able to get they gear. This needs to be applied to the Curse campaign. Curse campaigns are limited across the realms and sometimes you have classes that aren't PVE friendly that need to go through them. Toning them down to the OW levels in terms of difficulty is only natural to better reflect the current population. At it's current difficulty level I believe more people would naturally gravitate to the BP alternative to obtain this gear than the PVE route due to the amount of players required to get past the back half of the quest series. Keeping it at such a difficult level will lead to its death.

    I would also like to see Cursed lowered down to OW levels of difficulty. I did OW the other night with a buddy of mine and we ran with 4 rangers, a nightshade, and a warden and we were able to do 1-9 without much difficulty. We did have a few more at the start but quickly lost most of the group member by the 2nd step. I actually enjoy OW and Curse, but I think people just get frustrated when you have PvE that requires a BG to complete. That is tough on a lot of people to be on when the BG's are running.
  • Just make it all soloable. A lot of us don’t have the time to join scheduled raids due to real life grown up stuff like families and jobs...
  • The biggest hit to DAoC population over the years was the creation of the 'raid'. Dragon loot was uncommon across all realms because it took a lot of people and it took an hour or more to do, But then ML's came out and you could spend 2-3 hours per 'raid', people just dont have that kind of time so they left. Some of that has changed over the years, but one thing hasn't. People dont want to spend or dont have the time to spend 3 hours straight on a single 'quest event'. If each step could be done out of succession it would be a lot better for the community as a whole, this includes all 3 realms. Create the 'series' as more of a set way of questing, you have to complete all 10 parts but shouldn't matter in what order you do them so you dont have to change your RL schedule to fit your gaming schedule, RL wins every time. Also adding /bg grantcredit back into the game is always needed with anything 'raid' related.

    All this being said, please stop copy and pasting new things on old things, You're breaking the game, dont believe me? Go to Jordhiem, run from the throne room to either exit without leaving and then run back to the throne room and you'll see what I'm talking about. That's just the most consistent bug. All the OW and Curse things have broken their counter-parts and created either crash bugs or fall through the world issues. Either use existing mobs, update loot from existing quests, or create something entirely different as copy and paste with fog doesn't work.

    To recap:
    remove order to quest lines, BG can then just do the steps a BG is needed for.
    return /bg grantcredit
    think about time dedicated to quests series' before adding new ones

    Advice:
    Stop breaking the game by copy and pasting new 'events' onto old locations and adding fog
    Remove /use on items
    Add 6 hour RvR realm timer
    Advertise
    The first 3 steps needed to improve DAoC, everything else is a waste of time
  • Solicfear1 wrote: »
    Would love it if we could go back to farming stuff as groups

    woah. he said it <3.

  • GigGig
    edited August 2018 PM
    null
    you get less ppl now cause they inserted curse tokens for bps, those tokens were just another way to spread the scissor between returners and ppl that are setup, a bad idea actually.

    ppl that have bps/plat dont have to lead raids now anymore for endgame loot, i've lead like 3 raids a week before now since curse tokens i dont lead anymore and thats the point to dont lead it.

    you can make it easier yea but ppl would still not lead it cause you can skip it completely.
    Post edited by Gig on
  • tald wrote: »
    Solicfear1 wrote: »
    Would love it if we could go back to farming stuff as groups

    woah. he said it <3.

    The Campaigns destroyed battlegroup PvE. It's pretty awful to lead and i think many bg leaders could say there needs to be a lot of improvements.
  • daoc is a pvp game, we're not interested in pve. proof of this is that those pve folks would be in gaheris now.

    i like doing pve in daoc though, for when i'm not in the mood or there's nothing to do in rvr.

    pve shouldn't be so frustrating though, and not provide pvp endgear.

    i'd like the ow\curse and future endgame gear to be revamped in old content, instead of creating new and buggy one.

    just revamp the difficulty (but not much, i'd say doable with maybe 2-3 active (no afk\bot) groups) of all SI, TOA, Cata dungeons and put all the new stuff there.

    you already have a lot of unused content, no need to create more.

    but as a said, pve shouldn't provide endgame pvp gear, so maybe my idea is to have the same gear dropped in pve and buyable with the future pvp currency, but the pve dropped one does not have procs\use?

    this way you would be far more competitive in pvp than king gear, but not as much as a full pvp set.

    and having the same bonuses applied lets you for example run with a full pve gear and upgrade everytime you're able to buy new pvp gear without holding it because it screws your tp\stats.
  • Skywalker wrote: »
    daoc is a pvp game, we're not interested in pve. proof of this is that those pve folks would be in gaheris now.

    i like doing pve in daoc though, for when i'm not in the mood or there's nothing to do in rvr.

    pve shouldn't be so frustrating though, and not provide pvp endgear.

    i'd like the ow\curse and future endgame gear to be revamped in old content, instead of creating new and buggy one.

    just revamp the difficulty (but not much, i'd say doable with maybe 2-3 active (no afk\bot) groups) of all SI, TOA, Cata dungeons and put all the new stuff there.

    you already have a lot of unused content, no need to create more.

    but as a said, pve shouldn't provide endgame pvp gear, so maybe my idea is to have the same gear dropped in pve and buyable with the future pvp currency, but the pve dropped one does not have procs\use?

    this way you would be far more competitive in pvp than king gear, but not as much as a full pvp set.

    and having the same bonuses applied lets you for example run with a full pve gear and upgrade everytime you're able to buy new pvp gear without holding it because it screws your tp\stats.

    DAoC is not just a pvp game even though most pvpers would like to think so. there are some that enjoy the pve and even back in the days relic runs when they meant something.

    I agree that there are a lot of old places that need to be reused before building more places. Cear SIdi in alb and hib/mids equivalent

  • So maybe its just me, but I've always been able to get curse 1-8 done with nothing more then an 8 man
  • Armarnidi wrote: »
    So maybe its just me, but I've always been able to get curse 1-8 done with nothing more then an 8 man

    TBH I still wouldn't want to spend 3+ hours doing Curse 1-8 even if I could do it with a fg
  • Apologies if you think we're being silent on this btw, we're not and we do have some changes in the works. Unfortunately some changes take longer than 2 mins.
    DAoC Community Lead
    Broadsword Online Games
  • Ok. Well give you 5 minutes :wink:
  • @Armarnidi How do you do step 5-8 with a fg?
  • @RonELuvv its all in the grp setup
  • Armagedden wrote: »
    Armarnidi wrote: »
    So maybe its just me, but I've always been able to get curse 1-8 done with nothing more then an 8 man

    TBH I still wouldn't want to spend 3+ hours doing Curse 1-8 even if I could do it with a fg

    and I can do 1-8 with a fg in 1 hour and 45 minutes
  • Armarnidi wrote: »
    @RonELuvv its all in the grp setup

    and I can do 1-8 with a fg in 1 hour and 45 minutes

    Is issue is that players of all experience levels, but in particular casual and new players, would not necessarily be able to field the perfect group setup to do the curse quest series. The entire point is how long and unfriendly the quest series is to players. Arguing that it can be completed by the perfect group does nothing to refute the point that new and casual players are having trouble with the current form of these quests.
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  • or the new/returning casual player can just join my bg when I run it and stay out of my way and just get credit
  • 2 mins????? The whole campaign has been out for over 9 months... still is as buggy as when it went live.... I have been back since January and have yet to fix anything...
  • Apologies if you think we're being silent on this btw, we're not and we do have some changes in the works. Unfortunately some changes take longer than 2 mins.

    Wow, that´s almost resemblance feedback, for 5 m(onths) i thought management died and the Hamster was running amok....
  • edited August 2018 PM
    I think some people seem to forget about new and returning players. Yes, if you've played this game for years you are going to probably adept pretty quick to these campaigns. However with new and returners, they are not used to it and they have to pretty much work things out pretty quickly in order to keep up.

    I for one don't think this campaign is friendly at all to new and returning players and it's been shown in my battlegroups. They struggle to get the concept of speaking to NPC's and really understanding what order they have to speak to certain NPC's. The salle pet idea on Hibernia was a terrible idea because it just confuses people when they have to speak to either Real salle or their pet. This whole campaign is just full of confusion and sadly Broadsword fail to understand the reasons why and that's why everyone complaining about this campaign. I've said for months they need to keep it simple and make it so you speak to one NPC and that's it. Get rid of the salle pet's and just make the bosses slightly harder in order to make it challenging. You've got to make PvE fun or people are going to hate it, the only reason people are doing these campaigns is because they have too to get good gear. Otherwise it would of been put in the trash long ago!

    True, I understand Carol that you've got other projects on your mind and you can't change things over night but this has been 9 months and still there needs to be improvements and we've put feedback in order to make it better. Sadly it's to late in the day and since you've put tokens out for people to skip chapter 1-8 that's told us you really don't care about this campaign and want people to skip it.

    I really don't understand why you even bothered with this campaign if you knew you were going to either nerf it or get tokens for it. It really shows that you have no faith in this campaign whatsoever.

    I don't get why you guys just didn't look at the nalstagia stuff in DAoC and get people to farm items rather than do these huge campaigns that are buggy, confusing and just awful to lead. Why don't you go back to the start of DAoC and look at that PvE and implement these things back! Why are we making new campaigns that just don't work? I've been frustrated with this question for the last 2 campaigns and people can say I cry a lot and probably i do but when you got others saying the same thing then there has to be a problem with it!
    Post edited by Solicfear1 on
  • edited August 2018 PM
    Armarnidi wrote: »
    or the new/returning casual player can just join my bg when I run it and stay out of my way and just get credit

    I don't think players having to play adjust their schedules to play around another's in the hopes of getting into one of those raids is the most effective solution to the very real problem of how long and difficult these quest series can be. I can understand when the population was higher how that might be the norm, however the population being what it is, that certainly isn't a feasible approach today.
    Post edited by Sovereign on
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  • Solicfear1 wrote: »
    I don't get why you guys just didn't look at the nalstagia stuff in DAoC and get people to farm items rather than do these huge campaigns that are buggy, confusing and just awful to lead. Why don't you go back to the start of DAoC and look at that PvE and implement these things back! Why are we making new campaigns that just don't work? I've been frustrated with this question for the last 2 campaigns and people can say I cry a lot and probably i do but when you got others saying the same thing then there has to be a problem with it!

    Really they should do to old DAoC/SI/ToA zones what they did with the main dungeons in each realm (when they added in the dungeon explorer NPC's, updated the loot tables of the mobs and added in a few straightforward fun kill quests).

    BS can do "campaigns" of re-exploring old zones. Add in, starting at level 1-10 to 50, new zone explorer NPC's that can teleport you from main capitals/towns to zones in SI where NPC's have updated, low step (1-4/5 steps) quests that involve defeating mobs in SI, delivering goods, searching for items, defeating named mobs. Then you can add in an "advancement campaign" to ToA at a later time. This way you're re-invigorating already developed areas, updating loot tables/drops from mobs that already exist in these areas and you can still produce pve "campaigns" that would be fun to complete whether solo/duo/small/fg, ect.

    Expanding upon already developed content should also reduce the resources needed to produce such additional pve content and allow for those saved resources to be used towards continual bug fixing/small tweaking of current issues that plague the community.
  • edited August 2018 PM
    @Armarnidi I am still curious how you manage to do steps 5 and 7 with a fg. I have only done Curse on Hib, but even woth 3 fg's step 5 can be a chore. How do you watch all 3 ports, kill the mobs, and keep Salle alive on chapter 5 with a fg? Then on the dragon and the other random mob, what group set up lets you do that with a fg? I don't doubt you when you say it, but I'm just curious what set up and steps allow you to do this. Let me know next time you run and I would love to tag along and take some notes.
    Post edited by RonELuvv on
  • RonELuvv wrote: »
    @Armarnidi I am still curious how you manage to do steps 5 and 7 with a fg. I have only done Curse on Hib, but even woth 3 fg's step 5 can be a chore. How do you watch all 3 ports, kill the mobs, and keep Salle alive on chapter 5 with a fg? Then on the dragon and the other random mob, what group set up lets you do that with a fg? I don't doubt you when you say it, but I'm just curious what set up and steps allow you to do this. Let me know next time you run and I would love to tag along and take some notes.

    ch5 on alb is easier than ch5 on hib no portals and stuff
  • Interesting!! I had no idea they were so different between the realms @Skywalker.
  • Skywalker wrote: »
    RonELuvv wrote: »
    @Armarnidi I am still curious how you manage to do steps 5 and 7 with a fg. I have only done Curse on Hib, but even woth 3 fg's step 5 can be a chore. How do you watch all 3 ports, kill the mobs, and keep Salle alive on chapter 5 with a fg? Then on the dragon and the other random mob, what group set up lets you do that with a fg? I don't doubt you when you say it, but I'm just curious what set up and steps allow you to do this. Let me know next time you run and I would love to tag along and take some notes.

    ch5 on alb is easier than ch5 on hib no portals and stuff

    Chapter 5 on Alb is much easier in terms of difficulty, however when you figure in bugginess it becomes just as annoying as on Hib. Also, I fail to see how chapter 7 on Alb can be done with a FG given the bugginess of it and the tendency for all there mobs to aggro at once.
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