Ranger rr5 should have been nerfed by now

BS has made changes to the stealth classes. I can see why.....stealth zergs are a cancer and needed to be toned down. What I don't understand is wny has the ranger rr5 not been addressed. At minimum, it should have been a pet scare, not a pet attack. It is incredibly unbalanced. The personal bias that created this unbalance is a dirty secret everyone knows. It is time to adjust the ranger rr5 to something more balanced.
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  • Buffsteria alt spotted
  • Agreed! lol
  • Mctana wrote: »
    Buffsteria alt spotted

    Two totally different people. I like them both but I will say that the game is better off with Kat in it! Don't leave us again Kat!
  • Archers RR5 should all be same. Different characteristics , but same escape tools. Kat been around forever and generally right on most things.
  • Mctana wrote: »
    Buffsteria alt spotted

    Not quite. Buffsteria is much nicer then I am. I actually meet you many years ago when we both played on Alb, then Hib. Many, many years ago.

    And thanks @The_Classic_Dude and @Mace80 /hugs
  • 35 Celtic Dual still provides a frontal root style, right?

    That's really all you need against pets as a ranger.
  • I know Kat’s A different person, just laughed at the complaint about another archer’s RR5 ability.
  • Seemed Buffsteria like. lol
  • Kat been around forever and generally right on most things.

    Especially on one specific thing. We need the old Hunter RR5 back.

  • Add the 6 letters before!! lol
  • I just want the old Scout RR5 back...Oh and I don't "know" Kat but I always liked seeing her Hunter rip people.
  • Of course I remember you Kat. :)
  • Sever the tether needs to go. Lore wise it makes zero sense.
    That said need a different spokesperson than OP.
  • Fateboi wrote: »
    That said need a different spokesperson than OP.

    What's your problem, Oscar Madison?
  • KatKat
    edited November 28 PM
    Fateboi wrote: »
    Sever the tether needs to go. Lore wise it makes zero sense.
    That said need a different spokesperson than OP.

    Probably so...I went scorched earth on the hunter rr5. Thing is...the ranger rr5 doesn't just effect hunters. I am kind of surprised this has not come up for discussion. Esp when there are hib stealth zergs with 16+ running around. The rr5 is OP for solo/smallman, but for stealth zerg? Its obnoxious. I don't care who the spokesperson is, but this should be addressed.

    Hunters got nerfed. Sins got nerfed. Scouts are perpetually nerfed. Why is the ranger still allowed to have this ridiculous rr5?
    Post edited by Kat on
  • Kat wrote: »
    Why is the ranger still allowed to have this ridiculous rr5?

    Because "certain people's" whining has the ear of BS while the rest of us players can protest till we are blue in the mouth and won't be heard.

    Snipe spec Hunter needs to exist again. Bring back our old Hunter RR5. It existed for a reason.
  • KatKat
    edited November 28 PM
    I have been out of the game for awhile, but numerous people told me the hunter sniper spec was destroyed because BS didn't want snipers in game. So be it, its their game. Just curious.....does the ranger rr5 disable their bow? Has the sniper option been nerfed on hib?
    Post edited by Kat on
  • Remove remedy from archers.
  • Kat wrote: »
    I have been out of the game for awhile, but numerous people told me the hunter sniper spec was destroyed because BS didn't want snipers in game.

    What I saw was Gaven complain to numerous people that he didn't want Hunters to have Snipe Spec in game.
    Kat wrote: »
    Just curious.....does the ranger rr5 disable their bow? Has the sniper option been nerfed on hib?

    1. Absolutely not.
    2. No. The Celtic Dual line is full of escape styles. At level 35 they get an anytime root in case they haven't mastered any of the positionals that give them stun and snare at much earlier levels. They can still get to 50 Archery and 50 composite stealth without a hitch. Scouts also get a low level anytime shield stun. Hunters get a side snare at 21 Spear and need at least 39 Spear for a very hard to land (for the average situation) rear stun.

    I beg @John_Broadsword to listen to us and restore our subclass into existence.

  • They don’t listen to anyone that isn’t an elite soloer or in the 8man crowd. Quit complaining about anything stealth related, BS will eventually get rid off the class type by making people not want to play it. A free account can’t even create any stealth classes if you needed any more proof.
  • Keltorius wrote: »
    They don’t listen to anyone that isn’t an elite soloer or in the 8man crowd. Quit complaining about anything stealth related, BS will eventually get rid off the class type by making people not want to play it. A free account can’t even create any stealth classes if you needed any more proof.

    I agree. The solo/smallman stealthers had a place in the game, but the stealth zergs ruined the stealthers for everyone. They have done almost as much harm to the game as the pet/stealther patch. BS has to tone down stealthers, because what is necessary for a solo stealther is ridiculously OP in a stealth zerg. But, if BS decides to keep weakening the class, they really should just pull off the bandage and completely get rid of stealth. Because, by making them weaker, stealthers will group even more. It is a vicious circle. Stealth zergs are a cancer

    BTW. Keltorius, I don't recognize your name. What class/realm do you play?

  • KatKat
    edited November 29 PM
    nm.

    Post edited by Kat on
  • He's a stealth zerger @Kat
  • edited November 29 PM
    Buffsteria wrote: »
    Kat wrote: »
    I have been out of the game for awhile, but numerous people told me the hunter sniper spec was destroyed because BS didn't want snipers in game.

    What I saw was Gaven complain to numerous people that he didn't want Hunters to have Snipe Spec in game.
    Kat wrote: »
    Just curious.....does the ranger rr5 disable their bow? Has the sniper option been nerfed on hib?

    1. Absolutely not.
    2. No. The Celtic Dual line is full of escape styles. At level 35 they get an anytime root in case they haven't mastered any of the positionals that give them stun and snare at much earlier levels. They can still get to 50 Archery and 50 composite stealth without a hitch. Scouts also get a low level anytime shield stun. Hunters get a side snare at 21 Spear and need at least 39 Spear for a very hard to land (for the average situation) rear stun.

    Just thinking out loud, since you play a Hunter, doesn't the Hunter's pet snare style (10 seconds), doesn't the pet also have an on demand, 40% unbreakable snare.
    Also spear styles engage, w/follow up wounding thrust is a 40% slower for 14 seconds. Yet another Spear style Perforate (side style) 40% slow.

    This is all within the reach of the cookie cutter 49 bow/32 beast craft/34 spear/37 stealth (composite 50 rr3).
    Also that pesky rear 7 second stun if you spec higher spear.

    In the interest of overall class balance I'd say that Hunters are doing fairly well and so are Rangers. If anyone need some "adjusting" it's probably the Scout.

    GL
    Post edited by Fateboi on
  • KatKat
    edited November 29 PM
    Unfortunately, for scouts, BS can no longer look at each class on a solo level. Alb stealth zergs have minis, so they already have an advantage. It was bad enough out there when your trio would add on /chase me down, phatboi, but at least I had a tiny chance to get away. Not anymore. Over the week, I have watched rr11/12 stealth zergs blow everything to chase down and kill a solo rr3 in kings gear.

    Because of stealth zergs, we can't have nice things.
    Post edited by Kat on
  • Kat wrote: »
    Unfortunately, for scouts, BS can no longer look at each class on a solo level. Alb stealth zergs have minis, so they already have an advantage. It was bad enough out there when your trio would add on /chase me down, phatboi, but at least I had a tiny chance to get away. Not anymore. Over the week, I have watched rr11/12 stealth zergs blow everything to chase down and kill a solo rr3 in kings gear.

    Because of stealth zergs, we can't have nice things.

    Oh weird all of the sudden no rebuttal for the sheer amount of snare/stun/rr5 disease from the Hunter fan club?
    @Buffsteria
  • KatKat
    edited November 29 PM
    Fateboi wrote: »
    Kat wrote: »
    Unfortunately, for scouts, BS can no longer look at each class on a solo level. Alb stealth zergs have minis, so they already have an advantage. It was bad enough out there when your trio would add on /chase me down, phatboi, but at least I had a tiny chance to get away. Not anymore. Over the week, I have watched rr11/12 stealth zergs blow everything to chase down and kill a solo rr3 in kings gear.

    Because of stealth zergs, we can't have nice things.

    Oh weird all of the sudden no rebuttal for the sheer amount of snare/stun/rr5 disease from the Hunter fan club?
    @Buffsteria

    I am not the one that brought up snares, etc, but how the ranger rr5 is OP in today's game of stealth zergs, and that it doesn't enable their bow. I only addressed scouts, because you said they should be adjusted. You quote me, yet @buffsteria. You do realize we are not the same person?
    Post edited by Kat on
  • Fateboi wrote: »
    Oh weird all of the sudden no rebuttal for the sheer amount of snare/stun/rr5 disease from the Hunter fan club?
    @Buffsteria

    I have addressed all of these in previous posts. It is not necessary that I keep repeating myself to random people once BS has read my feedback.
  • If you nerf sins or archers you just force them to group more. Most of the stealth zergs started on the light tank patch where a solo or duo got rolled by a solo they "had" to fight (stealth lore cape). Buff them and nerf their group friendliness (unable to see other grouped stealth at all times) and you should get more duos or solos (with some zergs).
  • Nope no more buffs needed, if anything the Scout the rr5 is underwhelming.
  • KatKat
    edited December 2 PM
    rocketait wrote: »
    If you nerf sins or archers you just force them to group more. Most of the stealth zergs started on the light tank patch where a solo or duo got rolled by a solo they "had" to fight (stealth lore cape). Buff them and nerf their group friendliness (unable to see other grouped stealth at all times) and you should get more duos or solos (with some zergs).

    That has already happened. Genie is out of the bottle. If you buff any stealther, you are buffing the stealth zergers as well. Scouts can't be looked at as an individual class due to the stealth imbalance of mini's. Only way scouts could get buffed is if mini's lost stealth. Kind of sucks for scouts, but currently the alb stealth trio is a reality and mini's can't be ignored when looking at buffing alb stealthers

    It would be nice if BS did make it so they can't see each other in groups. Maybe....the more people in the group, the less effective the stealth - i.e for every person in the group composite stealth drops a tic? No idea if that is even possible.

    After being away for over a year, I can finally see why BS has to neuter the stealthers....but, it should be all stealthers. For some weird reason, rangers are the only stealther class that not only wasn't nerfed in some way, they were improved since the stealther patch. I think it would be nice to see class balance across all stealther classes.

    Post edited by Kat on
  • Remove grouped stealth vision. (easy and not a major nerf)

    I also like the lower Mastery Of Stealth idea.
    1-2 in group = 0% stealth penalty
    3-4 in group = 20% stealth penalty
    5-6 in group = 40% stealth penalty
    7-8 in group = 60% stealth penalty

    That would make them much more likely to get discovered by groups which feeds 8m and small man rps (everything they dodge) all while making it a little safer for solo and duo players.
    Impounded - Warrior__________Gimpound - Champion
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  • edited December 2 PM
    Kat wrote: »
    rocketait wrote: »
    If you nerf sins or archers you just force them to group more. Most of the stealth zergs started on the light tank patch where a solo or duo got rolled by a solo they "had" to fight (stealth lore cape). Buff them and nerf their group friendliness (unable to see other grouped stealth at all times) and you should get more duos or solos (with some zergs).

    That has already happened. Genie is out of the bottle. If you buff any stealther, you are buffing the stealth zergers as well. Scouts can't be looked at as an individual class due to the stealth imbalance of mini's. Only way scouts could get buffed is if mini's lost stealth. Kind of sucks for scouts, but currently the alb stealth trio is a reality and mini's can't be ignored when looking at buffing alb stealthers

    It would be nice if BS did make it so they can't see each other in groups. Maybe....the more people in the group, the less effective the stealth - i.e for every person in the group composite stealth drops a tic? No idea if that is even possible.

    After being away for over a year, I can finally see why BS has to neuter the stealthers....but, it should be all stealthers. For some weird reason, rangers are the only stealther class that not only wasn't nerfed in some way, they were improved since the stealther patch. I think it would be nice to see class balance across all stealther classes.

    Interesting you advocate for the Hunter rr5 along with @Buffsteria yet Scout's RR5 can't even be looked at due to the Minstrel. Just an FYI Minstrel is a base class rogue and has been since since Beta.

    While I understand that stealth zergs are 100% out of control, and have a direct effect on the RvR in every aspect. I find that your biased opinion the EXACT reason why stealth is unbalanced in 2020.
    So let's neuter "stealthers" after you have already made it to rr11 during the timeframe of the "great realm points giveaway". Your Hunter class deserve X,Y,Z and nerf Albion Stealthers because Minstrel's because of X, Y, Z...

    Reverting free MOS9 and moving it back into an RA was a great idea. Next it's time to remove Remedy from all Archer's period dot. Remedy was originally a NS ability that was given to the other Sins. Now that we are reverting back the Stealth Revamp changes it's time for Remedy to be completely removed from Archers.
    Post edited by Fateboi on
  • KatKat
    edited December 2 PM
    Fateboi wrote: »
    Kat wrote: »
    rocketait wrote: »
    If you nerf sins or archers you just force them to group more. Most of the stealth zergs started on the light tank patch where a solo or duo got rolled by a solo they "had" to fight (stealth lore cape). Buff them and nerf their group friendliness (unable to see other grouped stealth at all times) and you should get more duos or solos (with some zergs).

    That has already happened. Genie is out of the bottle. If you buff any stealther, you are buffing the stealth zergers as well. Scouts can't be looked at as an individual class due to the stealth imbalance of mini's. Only way scouts could get buffed is if mini's lost stealth. Kind of sucks for scouts, but currently the alb stealth trio is a reality and mini's can't be ignored when looking at buffing alb stealthers

    It would be nice if BS did make it so they can't see each other in groups. Maybe....the more people in the group, the less effective the stealth - i.e for every person in the group composite stealth drops a tic? No idea if that is even possible.

    After being away for over a year, I can finally see why BS has to neuter the stealthers....but, it should be all stealthers. For some weird reason, rangers are the only stealther class that not only wasn't nerfed in some way, they were improved since the stealther patch. I think it would be nice to see class balance across all stealther classes.

    Interesting you advocate for the Hunter rr5 along with @Buffsteria yet Scout's RR5 can't even be looked at due to the Minstrel. Just an FYI Minstrel is a base class rogue and has been since since Beta.

    While I understand that stealth zergs are 100% out of control, and have a direct effect on the RvR in every aspect. I find that your biased opinion the EXACT reason why stealth is unbalanced in 2020.
    So let's neuter "stealthers" after you have already made it to rr11 during the timeframe of the "great realm points giveaway". Your Hunter class deserve X,Y,Z and nerf Albion Stealthers because Minstrel's because of X, Y, Z...

    Reverting free MOS9 and moving it back into an RA was a great idea. Next it's time to remove Remedy from all Archer's period dot. Remedy was originally a NS ability that was given to the other Sins. Now that we are reverting back the Stealth Revamp changes it's time for Remedy to be completely removed from Archers.

    No where in this thread have I advocated for the hunter rr5. Though I would like a rr5 that lets me use a bow, I am not advocating for the return of the rr5. I gave up on that. So your whole post is invalid. You seem to have a real problem staying on topic. You agreed the ranger rr5 is OP, yet keep going off on tangents that have nothing to do with the subject.

    And, btw, if you revert everything back before the stealth revamp, you do realize that would return the hunter rr5?
    Post edited by Kat on
  • Impounded wrote: »
    Remove grouped stealth vision. (easy and not a major nerf)

    I also like the lower Mastery Of Stealth idea.
    1-2 in group = 0% stealth penalty
    3-4 in group = 20% stealth penalty
    5-6 in group = 40% stealth penalty
    7-8 in group = 60% stealth penalty

    That would make them much more likely to get discovered by groups which feeds 8m and small man rps (everything they dodge) all while making it a little safer for solo and duo players.

    Exactly! This man gets it :) Just trying to come up with ideas that tone down the damage stealth zergs have done to the game, without totally ruining stealthers completely.
  • How about we just make stealth completely undetectable and unable to initiate an attack(defensive damage only). They can spy and pass intell to their little hearts content.
    Vanish. What a joke. Tantamount to /qtd
  • I like Impounded's plan and I have advocated for something similar. However, as time goes on and we learn more about the cowardice of stealth zergers I'm convinced they'd just form multiple 4 man groups in the same area and work together the same as before. Heck... it'd probably backfire and they would end up with even more than 8 in the long run.

    It comes down to what motivates them... and it ain't competition. They just want easy rpts.... anything that forces them to learn how to get the most out of their toons and carries a little bit of risk is not in their gaming plans that is for damn certain.
  • KatKat
    edited December 2 PM
    Mace80 wrote: »
    I like Impounded's plan and I have advocated for something similar. However, as time goes on and we learn more about the cowardice of stealth zergers I'm convinced they'd just form multiple 4 man groups in the same area and work together the same as before. Heck... it'd probably backfire and they would end up with even more than 8 in the long run.

    It comes down to what motivates them... and it ain't competition. They just want easy rpts.... anything that forces them to learn how to get the most out of their toons and carries a little bit of risk is not in their gaming plans that is for damn certain.

    Good point..but, if they do move to smallmans, they wouldn't see each other as well.

    And, Hi <3
    Post edited by Kat on
  • you guys know that BS will just ignore about 99% of this thread, they wont remove stealth, they wont nerf "stealth" they wont touch "stealth" thus why they call them "stealthers"... how many years will you guys try? it's been 18 years. LOL some people enjoy stealther classes only, thus the groups. any 8 man visi with a brain can take them out. just because you solo or small man, doesn't mean its killing the game when u run into a fkin sneak group as a solo or small man....that's like saying get rid of visi 8 mans... because obviously they will run ur asses over as well.. LOL nerf this, nerf that, rid this, rid that, same story different year ;) just get good, or roam in other areas to avoid them, not that hard. or get a SL item or a sneak to pop them for you, wow 5head.
  • I actually for once agree with Kat. Making the ranger rr5 a pet scare would be completely justified imo. The pet attack is just flat out unbalanced its current state imo.
  • edited December 3 PM
    [not needed] the stealth zergs prey on the smaller numbers. You think comparing 8m that don’t actively search out solos and duos is a comparison? Wow [removed]
    No sh*t an 8m can kill them hell people kill them solo at times. They don’t ever learn their characters in any actual way thus resulting in more grouping.

    Just last night I watched a stealth group kill the same kings gear player repeatedly for about an hour. The guy was just trying to get some bounty points. Then they would leave the trio that was also roaming there.
    Just a trio.. skald/healer/thane nothing special... but they were afraid of it lol.
    Post edited by Carol_Broadsword on
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  • They would have got rofl stomped by a good trio.
  • edited December 2 PM
    Its not only stealthers that do that. Go to any of the 3 "solo" zones and you find duelers there who act similar. I tried to work on a new character bps. Never attacked anyone. I was rocking kings gear so when the rr11's that jumped me did so, i simply sat down to quicken the death (on my rr2 character). I did this 4 times, the whole time watching the rr11's avoid one another, or attack opposing realms who jumped the "duelers". After my 4th run i logged onto my stealther and sat patiently waiting for that moment when i could turn the tides. I avoid these areas like the plague usually. I dislike the dueling zones, but in this case, i wanted to retaliate a bit.

    As far as the rr5 goes. I've adjusted on my hunter. I miss the rr5, but i doubt they will ever revisit it. I will say out of the 3, the rangers rr5 was buffed more and offers the best option for sniper spec or melee. BS totally revoked my rr5 use on my hunter... i was 100% sniper until the change. Take a bow from a snipers hand (hunter rr5) and he's not a sniper anymore... he's a 50 bow/50 pet class with extremely low spear. Hit your rr5 as a hunter and your bow is gone. Ranger hits his rr5 and turns the pet and you've just negated one full spec lines of a class. I wish my hunter rr5 could negate a complete spec line.... that would rock. As a hunter, i would be completely ignoring facts if i continued to spec sniper (man i miss that spec). Using my class RR5 completely removes my ability to fire my bow for x amount of time... so there goes those 50 spec points into archery.... three choices. Deal with it... gripe about it.. or quit. BS doesnt really care.
    Post edited by Sleepwell on
  • That is broadswords bad idea to make Trelle, Moy, Folley the box area. Should place them elsewhere. It's kind of obvious a kings gear rr1 with no CLs isn't ready to run into a place full of good templated players that solo frequently. But hey... I guess that wasn't taken into consideration lol. Either way a lot of us that went up there were against killing box questers but there are some cold hearted players that would just farm you poor souls.

    "A few bad apples spoil the bunch"

    As far as topic goes I stand by my points. Stealth Zergs are a cancer and should be penalized for grouping so many. I don't want to nerf stealth classes just the ones that group. aka my previous post.
    Impounded - Warrior__________Gimpound - Champion
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  • Its the chicken and egg though @Impounded . You arent going to change people playstyle or opinion. Have i solo'd, yes. Duo'd, yes, trio.. zerged.. yes .. yes.. and yes. My reasoning for doing any of the above is cause and effect though. I've discussed this many times with @Phatboi and although he doesnt agree with my math, i stand by it. If 3 kill me solo, then am i remiss about bringing 6 to kil their 3? same odds.. then their 9 comes to kill my 6.. before you know it, its zerg v zerg.

    Unfair odds beget more unfair odds. Hero zerg dominates during specific time. Mid zerg dominates specific times.

    You will have those stealthers who (you're right) have no skill and therefore want to dominate by sheer numbers.... (sound like the hidden version of the Hero zerg to me). But you cannot dump every single stealther who groups into the same basket. If im run over by a small man every time i want to solo or duo, then its as much their fault that stealth zergs exist as anything else.
  • Reducing their stealth depending on the amount they have grouped will either make them group smaller or make it a higher risk for them. It's nothing that will make them any weaker as a class or group. It will just force them into more confrontations.

    The only one that will get penalized are the ones that group in large numbers. They all play similar, go to EV sit at a gate or safe path and let groups run through then pluck the little guy. Now if they had the stealth penalty for being in a big group that 8m or hell even the 3mans they dodge would have a far better chance uncovering their location and fighting them. I don't see the negative to generating more action and forcing them into conflict. It would create more action for the groups that fight them and would loosen the grip they have on those choke points. If they choose to group in duos and trios to lower that stealth penalty then that's great too.
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  • edited December 2 PM
    But offer no penalty to duo's, trios, small man, 8 man that rundown solos or smaller numbers? Your theory/solution could work there as well. I'm all for the stealth penalty as you've stated (and yes i love my hunter). Do something similar to the ones who are creating additional problems. Reduce run speed per player, or increase endurance usage the higher the number in your group/zerg.

    Your math would actually work pretty well in a visi group too...
    Solo no penalty
    Duo = 10% speed penatly, 10 % more endo usage
    3-4 in a group 20% speed penatly, 20% more endo usage
    5-6 in a group 40% speed penalty, 40% more endo usage
    7-8 in a group 60% speed penatly, 60% more endo usage

    Zergs would take care of themselves, unless people chose to group duo religiously (doubtful)

    Stealth adds that ability to dodge over anything. But ultimately the main reason i play my stealther at all is to avoid the larger zergs, the IRC groups that run over everything, and the duelers.
    Post edited by Sleepwell on
  • So based on some of the opinions here, unless you have great skills, you are not allowed to play stealth. It’s ok if those of marginal to less than can play visi, but if they group as sneaks, OMG they are scum.

    **** your elitist, self absorbed, I know better than you attitudes!!!!
  • edited December 2 PM
    I suck at both visi and stealth... and life... i need a "No longer suck at life" coin that i can purchase with Mithril...
    Post edited by Sleepwell on
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