Is it time to create a new Pre ToA server?

13

Answers

  • edited January 2019 PM
    It shows a solid 50% of the population is in NF. Include the Battlegrounds and the fraction of players occupying a RvR zone outweighs any other zone in the game. Why do you suppose that is the case?

    PvE players had no reason to stay could be one of the reasons ?

    That DAoC populations primary focus are RvR, but some might still like both RvR and PvE, so naturaly more will be in PvP ?

    54% of the population being in RvR should not prevent old PvE zones from dropping decent coin and rewards, i dont see why. None ( or well not me atleast :P ) are asking for new raids or huge PvE campaings, just to make whats there not suck.
    Post edited by Vrisslar on
  • Vrisslar wrote: »
    It shows a solid 50% of the population is in NF. Include the Battlegrounds and the fraction of players occupying a RvR zone outweighs any other zone in the game. Why do you suppose that is the case?

    PvE players had no reason to stay could be one of the reasons ?

    That DAoC populations primary focus are RvR, but some might still like both RvR and PvE, so naturaly more will be in PvP ?

    54% of the population being in RvR should not prevent old PvE zones from dropping decent coin and rewards, i dont see why. None ( or well not me atleast :P ) are asking for new raids or huge PvE campaings, just to make whats there not suck.

    The content hasn't changed, only the drops. Sounds like you're looking for a reason to farm old content as opposed to experiencing old content. Do we really need more items? I don't think so.
    "The grab bag isn't for explaining every single class change decision or reasoning or that's all we would ever do." - John_Broadsword
    "The type of of dev communication of 30 mins a day updates mentioned here just isn't feasible." - Carol_Broadsword
    "Our Studio. Our Rules." - http://www.mythicentertainment.com/
  • Make some the named mobs from old zones drop new loot. The Mouth in Lyn Barfog among others in all the realms. Make old classic zones more useful to go visit again. Just a thought is all. I think revamping there would have been better than OW or Curse.
  • edited January 2019 PM
    Vrisslar wrote: »
    DAoC is truly unique in the RvR scene and it's the reason why the game still has a population. All you have to do is compare /who NF and /who to know where most of the players are.

    Mid right now: /who = 117 and /who NF 64, thats roughly 54% in NF.

    Edit:
    Alb /who 115 and /who NF 65.
    Hib /who 125 and /who NF 64 with a BG on topax up in NF.

    what use is this again ? Edit: <---- that came out wrong and wasnt ment in an provocative or rude manner, sorry :/

    Looking at the other server they had over 3K login. This shows that there is a significant demand for Classic/Si/QoL along with the even playing field of a reset.

    In order to translate this to live it makes sense that a ladder or season lasting 2-6 months with Classic/SI/OF ruleset could potentially be viable. So you don't reduce Ywain at the end just auto transfer them back onto Ywain and get ready for another ladder/season of play i.e. Mordred or SI or another version of classic etc.
    Post edited by Fateboi on
  • edited January 2019 PM
    Vrisslar wrote: »
    It shows a solid 50% of the population is in NF. Include the Battlegrounds and the fraction of players occupying a RvR zone outweighs any other zone in the game. Why do you suppose that is the case?

    PvE players had no reason to stay could be one of the reasons ?

    That DAoC populations primary focus are RvR, but some might still like both RvR and PvE, so naturaly more will be in PvP ?

    54% of the population being in RvR should not prevent old PvE zones from dropping decent coin and rewards, i dont see why. None ( or well not me atleast :P ) are asking for new raids or huge PvE campaings, just to make whats there not suck.

    Exactly what I said

    We don't need new campaigns just use the content we got already but make it more useful. OW and Curse raids suck and don't really do anything.

    Post edited by Solicfear1 on
  • The content hasn't changed, only the drops. Sounds like you're looking for a reason to farm old content as opposed to experiencing old content. Do we really need more items? I don't think so.

    If you actualy bothered to read the posts i made in this thread it should be pretty clear what i personally want.

    I will try once more to make it clear what it is i would like and why it worries me.

    1. Higher population to RvR and do PvP with, not all of us enjoy zerging empty keeps.

    2. Other ways for new and returning players to grind out whats needed for a template, getting run over in RvR in kings gear while trying to get BP's isnt a fun experience ( unless you currently play on the side that have the BG zerg then i guess its fine ). Grinding OW and cursed for items to template, and then make alts to regrind it for plats, for the items that OW and cursed dosnt deliver for your template, or for items you might need 2 of, is quite sucky too. So yeah i would like for old content to deliver some form of progress for thise people in form of plat, items or tokens to trade for the items.
    With FTP around the corner i took a old buff bot account that havent been used for years and had been cleaned of everything, made a lvl 1 char with no buffbot in november and went on the journey as a new player but armed with the knowledge of a 17 year DAoC vet, all i talked to i was new player asking for help and had no knowledge, man was that a sucky ride.
    So no im not asking for myself, im asking for what i think would help with the experience that journey showed me.

    3. Personally i mainly PvP, but PvE when im in the mood to do that cause i enjoy that too at times, and i wish other things was worth something other then Cursed and OW.
    Personally im doing fine in DAoC, tho i disagree with alot of class changes and kind of scared of how long the game i love will live.

    Where was it again i said anything about needing new or more items ?

    Pretty sure i said all along that i wished for multiple ways to gain the same stuff, if a change had to be made to items it could be to shuffle resists on already used items or update procs and stats on older items, like ML10 weaps, having same or similar stats to CL15 weaps, but different procs. ( Personally my templates are weaponless, so stats dosnt really worry me )

    Pretty sure i also said i dont want stronger items and i dont want anything that creates more powercreep or force people to retemplate cause DAoC had more then enough of that and personally i dont like that.

    So basicly you ask a question to me that i already provided my opinion and answer to.

    Not gonna waste any more time on a troll who cant be arsed to read and just assume things, just ignore my posts and focus your efford on some of the people asking for the same or more, see if they bite.

    If the focus are 100% on PvP, why not just let everyone start at 50 in epic armor that caps all stats, atleast that would give people when FTP comes, a clear answer to what the game is aparently about acording to the majority as some say.

  • edited January 2019 PM
    Fateboi wrote: »
    In order to translate this to live it makes sense that a ladder or season lasting 2-6 months with Classic/SI/OF ruleset could potentially be viable. So you don't reduce Ywain at the end just auto transfer them back onto Ywain and get ready for another ladder/season of play i.e. Mordred or SI or another version of classic etc.

    Personally i like this idea.
    On other mmo's as old and older then DAoC, i sure have enjoyed event and progressions servers, its been a breath of fresh air to change things up abit, even tho i still love and play my old chars on the original servers of those games. It have made me spend more cash on those games, as the company with its ideas seem to care and have a plan for the future so money spend seem like a good investment.

    On DAoC with all my years here i have plenty of chars i would like to race change or edit something in the name, dont want to reroll them cause they are something special to me for different reasons, but with the price tag on those items and what seem to be a lack of vision and maybe care for DAoC, it makes me spend those money other places, where things actually happen and there seem to be a future. In no way am i bashing Broadsword or saying they dont care about DAoC, im saying the communication level and vision for the future, makes it seem to me like they dont care and my money spend today might have been wasted, cause the game might as well have its servers closed next week, as it could be next year. That said tho im grateful for the responses and help Carol provides.
    Post edited by Vrisslar on
  • Vrisslar wrote: »
    The content hasn't changed, only the drops. Sounds like you're looking for a reason to farm old content as opposed to experiencing old content. Do we really need more items? I don't think so.

    If you actualy bothered to read the posts i made in this thread it should be pretty clear what i personally want.

    I will try once more to make it clear what it is i would like and why it worries me.

    1. Higher population to RvR and do PvP with, not all of us enjoy zerging empty keeps.

    2. Other ways for new and returning players to grind out whats needed for a template, getting run over in RvR in kings gear while trying to get BP's isnt a fun experience ( unless you currently play on the side that have the BG zerg then i guess its fine ). Grinding OW and cursed for items to template, and then make alts to regrind it for plats, for the items that OW and cursed dosnt deliver for your template, or for items you might need 2 of, is quite sucky too. So yeah i would like for old content to deliver some form of progress for thise people in form of plat, items or tokens to trade for the items.
    With FTP around the corner i took a old buff bot account that havent been used for years and had been cleaned of everything, made a lvl 1 char with no buffbot in november and went on the journey as a new player but armed with the knowledge of a 17 year DAoC vet, all i talked to i was new player asking for help and had no knowledge, man was that a sucky ride.
    So no im not asking for myself, im asking for what i think would help with the experience that journey showed me.

    3. Personally i mainly PvP, but PvE when im in the mood to do that cause i enjoy that too at times, and i wish other things was worth something other then Cursed and OW.
    Personally im doing fine in DAoC, tho i disagree with alot of class changes and kind of scared of how long the game i love will live.

    Where was it again i said anything about needing new or more items ?

    Pretty sure i said all along that i wished for multiple ways to gain the same stuff, if a change had to be made to items it could be to shuffle resists on already used items or update procs and stats on older items, like ML10 weaps, having same or similar stats to CL15 weaps, but different procs. ( Personally my templates are weaponless, so stats dosnt really worry me )

    Pretty sure i also said i dont want stronger items and i dont want anything that creates more powercreep or force people to retemplate cause DAoC had more then enough of that and personally i dont like that.

    So basicly you ask a question to me that i already provided my opinion and answer to.

    Not gonna waste any more time on a troll who cant be arsed to read and just assume things, just ignore my posts and focus your efford on some of the people asking for the same or more, see if they bite.

    If the focus are 100% on PvP, why not just let everyone start at 50 in epic armor that caps all stats, atleast that would give people when FTP comes, a clear answer to what the game is aparently about acording to the majority as some say.

    There's already multiple approaches to obtaining end game gear. Adding more doesn't solve anything. New players won't have a hard time gearing up while leveling and definitely won't have issues at 50. Updating loot tables of old content probably would have been better than the campaigns but that didn't happen. At this point there's little reason to spend the time/resources to do so when obtaining end game gear is easier now than ever before.
    "The grab bag isn't for explaining every single class change decision or reasoning or that's all we would ever do." - John_Broadsword
    "The type of of dev communication of 30 mins a day updates mentioned here just isn't feasible." - Carol_Broadsword
    "Our Studio. Our Rules." - http://www.mythicentertainment.com/
  • Fateboi wrote: »
    Vrisslar wrote: »
    DAoC is truly unique in the RvR scene and it's the reason why the game still has a population. All you have to do is compare /who NF and /who to know where most of the players are.

    Mid right now: /who = 117 and /who NF 64, thats roughly 54% in NF.

    Edit:
    Alb /who 115 and /who NF 65.
    Hib /who 125 and /who NF 64 with a BG on topax up in NF.

    what use is this again ? Edit: <---- that came out wrong and wasnt ment in an provocative or rude manner, sorry :/

    Looking at the other server they had over 3K login. This shows that there is a significant demand for Classic/Si/QoL along with the even playing field of a reset.

    In order to translate this to live it makes sense that a ladder or season lasting 2-6 months with Classic/SI/OF ruleset could potentially be viable. So you don't reduce Ywain at the end just auto transfer them back onto Ywain and get ready for another ladder/season of play i.e. Mordred or SI or another version of classic etc.

    Your ladder system won`t work, there are not enough players that are braindead enough to repeat all the stuff each 2-6 month and after that their chars will be transfered to a server that they will not play. Why should a player leave a server where he gets all he wants 4 free (until the server lasts) and play on a ladder based server where he has to pay?

    The only option is a fresh new server, other ruleset than Ywain, even if that means that Ywain is bleeding out.
    It`s bleeding out anyways.....
  • Fateboi wrote: »
    Vrisslar wrote: »
    DAoC is truly unique in the RvR scene and it's the reason why the game still has a population. All you have to do is compare /who NF and /who to know where most of the players are.

    Mid right now: /who = 117 and /who NF 64, thats roughly 54% in NF.

    Edit:
    Alb /who 115 and /who NF 65.
    Hib /who 125 and /who NF 64 with a BG on topax up in NF.

    what use is this again ? Edit: <---- that came out wrong and wasnt ment in an provocative or rude manner, sorry :/

    Looking at the other server they had over 3K login. This shows that there is a significant demand for Classic/Si/QoL along with the even playing field of a reset.

    In order to translate this to live it makes sense that a ladder or season lasting 2-6 months with Classic/SI/OF ruleset could potentially be viable. So you don't reduce Ywain at the end just auto transfer them back onto Ywain and get ready for another ladder/season of play i.e. Mordred or SI or another version of classic etc.

    Your ladder system won`t work, there are not enough players that are braindead enough to repeat all the stuff each 2-6 month and after that their chars will be transfered to a server that they will not play. Why should a player leave a server where he gets all he wants 4 free (until the server lasts) and play on a ladder based server where he has to pay?

    The only option is a fresh new server, other ruleset than Ywain, even if that means that Ywain is bleeding out.
    It`s bleeding out anyways.....

    Yet thousands of people do it when the "other servers" appear. The ladder doesn't have to be limited to subs. It would be a great option for F2P.
    "The grab bag isn't for explaining every single class change decision or reasoning or that's all we would ever do." - John_Broadsword
    "The type of of dev communication of 30 mins a day updates mentioned here just isn't feasible." - Carol_Broadsword
    "Our Studio. Our Rules." - http://www.mythicentertainment.com/
  • Fateboi wrote: »
    Vrisslar wrote: »
    DAoC is truly unique in the RvR scene and it's the reason why the game still has a population. All you have to do is compare /who NF and /who to know where most of the players are.

    Mid right now: /who = 117 and /who NF 64, thats roughly 54% in NF.

    Edit:
    Alb /who 115 and /who NF 65.
    Hib /who 125 and /who NF 64 with a BG on topax up in NF.

    what use is this again ? Edit: <---- that came out wrong and wasnt ment in an provocative or rude manner, sorry :/

    Looking at the other server they had over 3K login. This shows that there is a significant demand for Classic/Si/QoL along with the even playing field of a reset.

    In order to translate this to live it makes sense that a ladder or season lasting 2-6 months with Classic/SI/OF ruleset could potentially be viable. So you don't reduce Ywain at the end just auto transfer them back onto Ywain and get ready for another ladder/season of play i.e. Mordred or SI or another version of classic etc.

    Your ladder system won`t work, there are not enough players that are braindead enough to repeat all the stuff each 2-6 month and after that their chars will be transfered to a server that they will not play. Why should a player leave a server where he gets all he wants 4 free (until the server lasts) and play on a ladder based server where he has to pay?

    The only option is a fresh new server, other ruleset than Ywain, even if that means that Ywain is bleeding out.
    It`s bleeding out anyways.....

    Yet thousands of people do it when the "other servers" appear. The ladder doesn't have to be limited to subs. It would be a great option for F2P.

    The *other* servers are full for other reasons, a fresh start is just one of them. And they won`t be full if a dev team would say * You can play, but we delete all stuff after 3-6 month*. For a player on a classic server is transfering a toon to Ywain exactly that...deleted. They`re not going to play on a ToA-Server.

    But it may be an option for returning+new players that know nothing about *other* servers, yep ok.
    Speculations, speculations....
  • Whats left to lose? The game is dead, it’s either get a new server with a progression out within a few months or just close it, there’s too much on the horizon (WoW Classic/CU) that any interest will just die.

    It’s not like it’s even hard, announce DAoC Reborn (or any other catchy name), release a trailer showing a few old battles and ramp up that nostalgia and let the hype train do all the work, switch Ywain to F2P and a sub for the classic servers.

    I repeat, what’s left to lose? You have maybe 500 max at prime time?
  • The ladder/season proposal is just a way to offer an alternative rule set for a limited duration of play. The purpose is to not completely gut Ywain hence the auto transfer at the end.

    The appeal is a chance to play Classic/Si potentiality other rulesets like Mordred.
  • At this point the population is so low they have had basically rp bonuses for 3 months straight with events overlapping to attempt weather the storm, it's time for them to SAY something anything about the future.
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  • They do say stuff...like sometime next year something will happen. And then it’s delayed til the next year lol
  • Haha I have to be careful with my wording I'm recently back from a 24 hour ban that lasted a week.
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  • Boduke wrote: »
    Haha I have to be careful with my wording I'm recently back from a 24 hour ban that lasted a week.

    Lol I have a mild warning still from um I think 3 or 4 months now. Who knew that petulant was such a bad reference, I thought it was quite apt.

    Played last night (silly me), was about 12k away from a ding, which is so far and few now it is silly. The rp's that you are now getting is absolutely ridiculous. 152k at the end of the night, but only 42k or so from actual kills. The game has turned into a pve quest for rps.

    There are some good ideas that are being thrown around, and some not so good. As much as I want this game to continue, it has no longer become fun. It is almost like a chore now to log in and listen to the constant bitching.
  • edited January 2019 PM
    They have to have the pvp quests for rps and bonuses do you think the bg players would log in if after 2-3 hours a night playing they seen the rps they earned is between 1-20k

    For clarity mods thats not bashing, it's confirming your decision it's needed
    Post edited by Boduke on
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  • The *other* servers are full for other reasons, a fresh start is just one of them. And they won`t be full if a dev team would say * You can play, but we delete all stuff after 3-6 month*. For a player on a classic server is transfering a toon to Ywain exactly that...deleted. They`re not going to play on a ToA-Server.

    But it may be an option for returning+new players that know nothing about *other* servers, yep ok.
    Speculations, speculations....

    Exactly... Speculations!! As a player who played on one of those other servers for a long time I know that most people wanted a reset for what reason again?! Answer: FRESH START! They wanted everyone on equal footing. Thats great, while it lasts for a few months. There is a reason that none of the "other" servers last in the long term, its because as the RR gap increases the population drops. That is a fact.
  • Fateboi wrote: »
    The ladder/season proposal is just a way to offer an alternative rule set for a limited duration of play. The purpose is to not completely gut Ywain hence the auto transfer at the end.

    The appeal is a chance to play Classic/Si potentiality other rulesets like Mordred.

    Exactly! Coming from a person who was originally opposed to the idea of a ladder/season idea I have to admit that it does satisfy the biggest reasons that alot of people don't play here. It gives people a chance to experience the game they remember (along with some QoL changes), it allows everyone a "fresh" start that puts everyone on equal footing, and it does all of this while still putting those same players back into Ywain at the end. Sure, most may not stay in Ywain and just wait for the next "season" but even if only a small portion stays that is better than nothing.

  • RonELuvv wrote: »
    The *other* servers are full for other reasons, a fresh start is just one of them. And they won`t be full if a dev team would say * You can play, but we delete all stuff after 3-6 month*. For a player on a classic server is transfering a toon to Ywain exactly that...deleted. They`re not going to play on a ToA-Server.

    But it may be an option for returning+new players that know nothing about *other* servers, yep ok.
    Speculations, speculations....

    Exactly... Speculations!! As a player who played on one of those other servers for a long time I know that most people wanted a reset for what reason again?! Answer: FRESH START! They wanted everyone on equal footing. Thats great, while it lasts for a few months. There is a reason that none of the "other" servers last in the long term, its because as the RR gap increases the population drops. That is a fact.

    Hence the idea for making a ladder / season server. Add ruleset / patch rotations and it could be amazing. Keeps it feeling new without actually being new.
    "The grab bag isn't for explaining every single class change decision or reasoning or that's all we would ever do." - John_Broadsword
    "The type of of dev communication of 30 mins a day updates mentioned here just isn't feasible." - Carol_Broadsword
    "Our Studio. Our Rules." - http://www.mythicentertainment.com/
  • Vrisslar wrote: »
    Fateboi wrote: »
    In order to translate this to live it makes sense that a ladder or season lasting 2-6 months with Classic/SI/OF ruleset could potentially be viable. So you don't reduce Ywain at the end just auto transfer them back onto Ywain and get ready for another ladder/season of play i.e. Mordred or SI or another version of classic etc.

    Personally i like this idea.
    On other mmo's as old and older then DAoC, i sure have enjoyed event and progressions servers, its been a breath of fresh air to change things up abit, even tho i still love and play my old chars on the original servers of those games. It have made me spend more cash on those games, as the company with its ideas seem to care and have a plan for the future so money spend seem like a good investment.

    For a guy who accused me of not reading his post (which I did btw), you obviously need to heed your own advice. I have been saying this WHOLE time that a ladder/season system would give what people are asking for, yet your last reply to me was filled with vitriol and complete misunderstanding.

    Also, would you make up your mind? You say you want more choices for gear but those choices exist. You can buy them, you can farm them doing actual PvE (sorry you don't like what is offered), or you can use BP's to acquire them. Basically, because you can't go out and farm a mob for hours on end to get an item you are butt hurt about it. Also, quit talking about "Oh, they only listen to the 5% on forums..." crap. Seriously!? What do you want them to do? How in the hell are we or BS supposed to get opinions of 18 years of players, many of which would never come back no matter what changes were made. Arguing with you is like arguing with idiots that say using herald stats to try and prove a point about classes is not the only stats to consider. Yah, its not everything, but its the best we have. You claim to know the opinions of thousands of players that don't want to comment, please inform us oh great visionary!! All BS can do is listen to the player base. Most of that comes from the forum posts. Like it or not, that is all they have to go on besides some exit surveys and other stuff. You literally trash on my post and act like I don't know a thing, contradict yourself, and then praise @Fateboi for saying EXACTLY what I stated numerous times. /facepalm

  • Exactly... Speculations!! As a player who played on one of those other servers for a long time I know that most people wanted a reset for what reason again?! Answer: FRESH START! They wanted everyone on equal footing. Thats great, while it lasts for a few months. There is a reason that none of the "other" servers last in the long term, its because as the RR gap increases the population drops. That is a fact.

    Hence the idea for making a ladder / season server. Add ruleset / patch rotations and it could be amazing. Keeps it feeling new without actually being new.[/quote]

    Amen @Beetleguisse! I was against it a long time ago when @Fateboi first mentioned it to me in the forums and on teamspeak. After thinking it over a long time ago, I had to agree.
  • edited January 2019 PM
    RonELuvv wrote: »

    For a guy who accused me of not reading his post (which I did btw), you obviously need to heed your own advice. I have been saying this WHOLE time that a ladder/season system would give what people are asking for, yet your last reply to me was filled with vitriol and complete misunderstanding.

    Also, would you make up your mind? You say you want more choices for gear but those choices exist. You can buy them, you can farm them doing actual PvE (sorry you don't like what is offered), or you can use BP's to acquire them. Basically, because you can't go out and farm a mob for hours on end to get an item you are butt hurt about it. Also, quit talking about "Oh, they only listen to the 5% on forums..." crap. Seriously!? What do you want them to do? How in the hell are we or BS supposed to get opinions of 18 years of players, many of which would never come back no matter what changes were made. Arguing with you is like arguing with idiots that say using herald stats to try and prove a point about classes is not the only stats to consider. Yah, its not everything, but its the best we have. You claim to know the opinions of thousands of players that don't want to comment, please inform us oh great visionary!! All BS can do is listen to the player base. Most of that comes from the forum posts. Like it or not, that is all they have to go on besides some exit surveys and other stuff. You literally trash on my post and act like I don't know a thing, contradict yourself, and then praise @Fateboi for saying EXACTLY what I stated numerous times. /facepalm

    Cause aparently you arent reading or understanding whats ment.

    Every post i have made i been speaking for myself and none else, maybe your ego is so big that personally covers an entire population. ;)

    I am not the one talking about majories or minorities, i have said multiple times that we cant know whos the majoriy and who isnt.
    Vrisslar wrote: »
    How is it excatly you know who's a minority in what ? the 5% using the forums ? your circle of friends that enjoy what you do ? I guess next we will be talking about the silent majority and putting words in the mouth of people who havent spoken them self yet. How about we all speak on our own behalf and let others speak for them self.

    Feel free to point out where i claim to know the opnion of thousands.

    I have never asked for the opnions of players from the last 18 years, the only person here talking about that are you. I have said it should be limited, other game companies can send out surveys to accounts that have been active in the past couple of year and been canceled. Aparently that cant be done here acording to you, its 18 years or nothing.

    Im not argueing with anyone, i say things as i seen them and have experiened them, if that dont fit your version of things, dosnt anoy me or piss me off, its matter of difference in opnion, but yeah it would be lovely for you if all people shared your view on things im sure. Where i come from people can disagree on things without name calling and argueing, i feel sorry for the place where you come from where this would seem not to be posible.

    About @Fateboi 's post i havent been talking about new servers, i think we should worry about the incomming FTP and what it brings new/returning players, i have said:
    Vrisslar wrote: »
    Personally i dont care about anything outside of the real DAoC servers, i just want my great 17 year journey with DAoC to last as long as possible. ( For that we need people back that are happy )

    Down the road a new server and FTP will be nice options, im just kind of scared that FTP now, with the game in its current situation will just give it a bad reputation, for anyone that actualy tries it and the people they talk to.
    As i said in my previous post i really belive some information collection is needed from former and current players in form of surveys, then a DAoC rescue, repair plan and vision for the future can be build around what is learned, in a direction that ofc stays true to what DAoC have always been.
    Vrisslar wrote: »
    1. Higher population to RvR and do PvP with, not all of us enjoy zerging empty keeps.

    2. Other ways for new and returning players to grind out whats needed for a template, getting run over in RvR in kings gear while trying to get BP's isnt a fun experience ( unless you currently play on the side that have the BG zerg then i guess its fine ). Grinding OW and cursed for items to template, and then make alts to regrind it for plats, for the items that OW and cursed dosnt deliver for your template, or for items you might need 2 of, is quite sucky too. So yeah i would like for old content to deliver some form of progress for thise people in form of plat, items or tokens to trade for the items.
    With FTP around the corner i took a old buff bot account that havent been used for years and had been cleaned of everything, made a lvl 1 char with no buffbot in november and went on the journey as a new player but armed with the knowledge of a 17 year DAoC vet, all i talked to i was new player asking for help and had no knowledge, man was that a sucky ride.
    So no im not asking for myself, im asking for what i think would help with the experience that journey showed me.

    3. Personally i mainly PvP, but PvE when im in the mood to do that cause i enjoy that too at times, and i wish other things was worth something other then Cursed and OW.
    Personally im doing fine in DAoC, tho i disagree with alot of class changes and kind of scared of how long the game i love will live.

    I think that the bleeding of players from ywain should be focused on before we worry about new servers, then worry about ftp and how returning/ new players see the game, getting players to return or bring new players, imo dosnt help if they dont stay.
    People that will have more ways to do things i think will get bored more slowly, making them stay longer, but again thats me and how i enjoy things, i dont claim or say that others see it that way and i dont claim to be a minority or majority.

    Im not butthurt about anything, and im not emotionally attached or addicted enough to any game to get pissed off about text in a discussion on a forum, a writen format where imo its hard to detect sarcasm, emotion and other things.

    However it would seem you have a problem like that, call me whatever you want, at the end of the day your just a random person i had a discussion with on a forum, where missunderstandings tend to happen cause not all people have english as their primary languange, who dont know me and dont really matter to me.

    So go ahead, instead of a having a discussion and asking for clarification on things you might have missed, blow up and name call, im pretty sure i write my own posts, so when i say you havent read what i wrote, then it would seem like you have either missed something or missunderstod something that could need clarifiaction, cause aparently it wasnt recived as it was ment, but yeah how should i know what was ment by my post and words, english isnt my primary language so things might have slipped, like it did to @Beetleguisse here:
    Vrisslar wrote: »
    DAoC is truly unique in the RvR scene and it's the reason why the game still has a population. All you have to do is compare /who NF and /who to know where most of the players are.

    Mid right now: /who = 117 and /who NF 64, thats roughly 54% in NF.

    Edit:
    Alb /who 115 and /who NF 65.
    Hib /who 125 and /who NF 64 with a BG on topax up in NF.

    what use is this again ? Edit: <---- that came out wrong and wasnt ment in an provocative or rude manner, sorry :/

    This part i regret writing too, but thats me at 4:30 AM having been up all night with a teething 8 month old and a sick 3 year old, so i brainfarted and said something i shouldnt have,
    Vrisslar wrote: »
    Not gonna waste any more time on a troll who cant be arsed to read and just assume things, just ignore my posts and focus your efford on some of the people asking for the same or more, see if they bite.

    Tho @Beetleguisse seems to have taken it like a champ.

    Anyways have a nice day @RonELuvv, if you had any questions to what i have written that you would have liked clarification on or didnt make sense to you, you could have just asked. Not gonna spend anymore time on what seem to be a agressive angry person like you, who seem to be just looking for a fight.

    Post edited by Vrisslar on
  • edited January 2019 PM
    Since I am here about giving my feedback i try to stay at points not argue with people, it's just my point of view playing since 2002 with few off times when I wasn't statisfied with the road DAoC took/IRL stuff that made me quit.

    1. Ladder-system: It's a great idea IF we already established a good playerbase which means not immediately killing Ywain. I think Ywain is a must have some sort of activity, since it's safety that guaranteed the longevity of DAoC. You know you can logg your favourite character from 5-10 year ago and get it dusted off which free servers will never offer. I think this step requires DAoC to be FTP before, so it can attract enough people.
    2. 1.65 argument: Certain things can't be taken back now on live, so I only see this in the Ladder-system perspective. There are many things that could be fixed in current live server too.
    3. There is enough option's for gear now / PvE is live still argument: To a certain degree true. However the PvE which currently available that worth doing is very narrow. Basically encourage creating new characters, do OW and Cursed if you wan't to earn plats, that's about it. Having DAoC's huge zones, dungeons, I think it's a big waste of potential making all viable PvE take place on two small encounters. Also, it's just my opinion, but the other mmos trendy quest system forced into DAoC system makes it really confusing for all new/returning player.

    Also, who thinks BP system is alternative, cmon. I recently decided to start new toon, made it to rr8, with quests around new year that provided huge BPs, from around rr4-8ish I could craft 2 items. Felt great about it, and it's a nice bonus, but if anyone think thats a viable option to gear up exclusively by BPs, I highly doubt someone will go out in epic armor who refuse to do OW and Cursed and get geared up with BPs. Maybe when they rr10-11ish in kings gear..

    As I myself see, Cursed and OW is the PvE and the best solution to gear up for RvR either. Most just go out and sell some GTCs and claim gearing up just by RvR is possible.

    Post edited by Gavner on
  • @Gavner Totaly agree, pretty much what im trying to say, just in bigger text walls trying to put in reasons as to why i think as i do, lol.
  • Oh, and I forgot that I am to totally cool with realm timers. I enjoyed game when I been locked to 1 realm / server too.
  • I had a long post here @Vrisslar in response, but flat out I'm done arguing with you. You say I don't read your post but you clearly didn't read my multiple posts prior to yours that said many of the things you wanted. Things like saying a progression/ladder server would be good, or that updating loot tables on current mobs and encounters without putting in new op'd charges/procs would give people something to do. Both of which were posted before your long post in reply to mine.
    Vrisslar wrote: »
    Every post i have made i been speaking for myself and none else, maybe your ego is so big that personally covers an entire population. ;)

    I am not the one talking about majories or minorities, i have said multiple times that we cant know whos the majoriy and who isnt.

    All BS (and myself) has to go on is what players tell them. If certain players choose not to post about why they do or don't like on the server than all those players can do is blame themselves for not getting those changes. If more players want PvE than I suggest those players start being more vocal. Like it or not, BS is limited in how they get information from players and the #1 source for 18 years has always been the forums. The forums have been clear that that majority of players want less PvE and more RvR. Period. You are stating your opinion. Nothing more. I am stating what I have READ from other players. I'm not giving you my opinion, I am giving you what OTHER PLAYERS STATE.

    For example: In the last 1-1.5 years that I have been here people have been vocal on the forums that they are tired of PvE content. They don't want to farm for months to get an item. They don't want to have to run giant BG events like Cursed or OW. Sure, there were a few who said they enjoyed PvE, but BS made the decision to listen to the more vocal community and lowered the difficulty of Cursed. They also added in the BP system to help people get template items without doing PvE based on the people asking for it in forums.

    Now @Gavner, I do agree that the BP system could use some tweaks to it to make it easier to use. As you stated, in it's current format it would take a very long time to template out a toon with just BP items. They should increase the items you can get with BP's, lower the cost of some of these items, and even make some of these quests repeatable. The Supplies for the Cause quest and Kings Ale quest should be repeatable as often as you want to do them. No reason to make them once a week. That way if new players want to spend hours running around in RvR zones getting BP's to get templated they are more than welcome. Increases the amount of people in RvR and gives them a faster way to make money or get a template w/out having to PvE.








  • edited January 2019 PM
    @RonELuvv I am pretty sure by PvE options @Vrisslar ment alternatives like currency (what have worked on dragons campaign before) or same/similar stat items elsewhere, so ppl not locked into 2 encounters repeatedly, and can progress solo too if none available. It's not difficult to make a few mob drop something.

    I doubt by liking PvE he ever ment liking OW and Cursed at all, in fact I remember on other topic he was also for lowering difficulty since not enough raids been around.

    Also think theres not much mindless boredom then pick up stuff for days while ppl like you and me free rp fram them. While being option there would be cool, lowering BP prices is necessary to be a real alternative. ATM lets be real, GTC or Cursed/OW to get temped. It's neither RvR nor PvE that most PvE guy liked doing in DAoC. As previously said, its sad that huge world has to offer 2 encounters only.
    Post edited by Gavner on
  • @Gavner @Vrisslar

    The amount of time and resources required to overhaul old content simply to add an alternative approach to gearing up isn't worth it at the moment. Remember, that was the whole point behind the PvE campaigns. They aimed to revamp old areas in a manner that prevented macro teams from farming them while promoting group play.

    You have two options to obtain gear: either do the encounters or buy it with BPs or coin. Other than adding another currency specifically for OW and Curse, I don't see how updating old content is going to help.

    Plat can be farmed anywhere outside of OW and Curse. Salvage and trinket still works well. Alchemy ingredients or potion are always in demand. There are alternative currencies you can farm to buy items AND you can even exchange between the currencies. The BP system was never meant to replace PvE. It provides an additional route to obtaining items albeit at a slower pace. Acquiring expensive items through the BP system has been fantastic if you don't want to grind Curse 9/10 or OW 10.

    I fail to see how there is lack of PvE content.
    "The grab bag isn't for explaining every single class change decision or reasoning or that's all we would ever do." - John_Broadsword
    "The type of of dev communication of 30 mins a day updates mentioned here just isn't feasible." - Carol_Broadsword
    "Our Studio. Our Rules." - http://www.mythicentertainment.com/
  • @Beetleguisse In the realm of 800-1000p temps someone saying trinket is alternative, good to know. Guess you don't do that.
  • I think BP system took way more effort then modifying loot tables or just throwing some items into existing currency stores. None asked for revamp in this topic I think.
  • Gavner wrote: »
    @Beetleguisse In the realm of 800-1000p temps someone saying trinket is alternative, good to know. Guess you don't do that.

    I do when I farm Alch ingredients. Never spent more plat than I can carry on a template.
    "The grab bag isn't for explaining every single class change decision or reasoning or that's all we would ever do." - John_Broadsword
    "The type of of dev communication of 30 mins a day updates mentioned here just isn't feasible." - Carol_Broadsword
    "Our Studio. Our Rules." - http://www.mythicentertainment.com/
  • edited January 2019 PM
    Gavner wrote: »
    @Beetleguisse In the realm of 800-1000p temps someone saying trinket is alternative, good to know. Guess you don't do that.

    You are talking about top shelf temps. A returning player would do just fine in a mix PC'd gear even just wearing a mixture of the OW/dragonslayer/PC'd etc.
    Post edited by Fateboi on
  • @Beetleguisse So you dont use OW Helms/Cursed Gloves/Season items? Maybe casters/support will get away with that, what do you play?

    Anyway, trinketing while farming Alch ingredients is like saying I farm gold from mob drops while on Cursed raids.
  • Fateboi wrote: »
    Gavner wrote: »
    @Beetleguisse In the realm of 800-1000p temps someone saying trinket is alternative, good to know. Guess you don't do that.

    You are talking about top shelf temps. A returning player would do just fine in a mix PC'd gear even just wearing a mixture of the OW/dragonslayer/PC'd etc.

    For Zerging, casual, maybe. Theres not a slight difference tho as we paint it.
  • Gavner wrote: »
    @Beetleguisse So you dont use OW Helms/Cursed Gloves/Season items? Maybe casters/support will get away with that, what do you play?

    Anyway, trinketing while farming Alch ingredients is like saying I farm gold from mob drops while on Cursed raids.

    Look at my signature to see what I play.

    I bought those items with BPs or I did the encounter(s). Didn't feel like spending the money to buy them from the Market Explorer.
    "The grab bag isn't for explaining every single class change decision or reasoning or that's all we would ever do." - John_Broadsword
    "The type of of dev communication of 30 mins a day updates mentioned here just isn't feasible." - Carol_Broadsword
    "Our Studio. Our Rules." - http://www.mythicentertainment.com/
  • Gavner wrote: »
    Fateboi wrote: »
    Gavner wrote: »
    @Beetleguisse In the realm of 800-1000p temps someone saying trinket is alternative, good to know. Guess you don't do that.

    You are talking about top shelf temps. A returning player would do just fine in a mix PC'd gear even just wearing a mixture of the OW/dragonslayer/PC'd etc.

    For Zerging, casual, maybe. Theres not a slight difference tho as we paint it.

    High end templates are more essential for solo play than group play.
    "The grab bag isn't for explaining every single class change decision or reasoning or that's all we would ever do." - John_Broadsword
    "The type of of dev communication of 30 mins a day updates mentioned here just isn't feasible." - Carol_Broadsword
    "Our Studio. Our Rules." - http://www.mythicentertainment.com/
  • Gavner wrote: »
    @Beetleguisse So you dont use OW Helms/Cursed Gloves/Season items? Maybe casters/support will get away with that, what do you play?

    Anyway, trinketing while farming Alch ingredients is like saying I farm gold from mob drops while on Cursed raids.

    Look at my signature to see what I play.

    I bought those items with BPs or I did the encounter(s). Didn't feel like spending the money to buy them from the Market Explorer.

    You know I did. :)

    So you did encounters/purchased from BP arguing PvE trinketing is valid to get temped? Thats exactly what I said, the only real viable is to just do them, and maybe craft 1 or 2 item, although that will take time.
  • Gavner wrote: »
    Gavner wrote: »
    @Beetleguisse So you dont use OW Helms/Cursed Gloves/Season items? Maybe casters/support will get away with that, what do you play?

    Anyway, trinketing while farming Alch ingredients is like saying I farm gold from mob drops while on Cursed raids.

    Look at my signature to see what I play.

    I bought those items with BPs or I did the encounter(s). Didn't feel like spending the money to buy them from the Market Explorer.

    You know I did. :)

    So you did encounters/purchased from BP arguing PvE trinketing is valid to get temped? Thats exactly what I said, the only real viable is to just do them, and maybe craft 1 or 2 item, although that will take time.

    Any approach is valid if you spend the time.
    "The grab bag isn't for explaining every single class change decision or reasoning or that's all we would ever do." - John_Broadsword
    "The type of of dev communication of 30 mins a day updates mentioned here just isn't feasible." - Carol_Broadsword
    "Our Studio. Our Rules." - http://www.mythicentertainment.com/
  • See your points when you trinketed your cursed items. I hope new / returning players gets advice what to do to get RvR ready elsewhere.
  • edited January 2019 PM
    The amount of time and resources required to overhaul old content simply to add an alternative approach to gearing up isn't worth it at the moment. Remember, that was the whole point behind the PvE campaigns. They aimed to revamp old areas in a manner that prevented macro teams from farming them while promoting group play.

    Im not asking for anything to get overhauled,i want to make old content worth doing. As an example i could come up with right here and now, add a merchant that sell every cursed, OW ,ML10, Dragon, summoner item, etc in the game. Then add a currency to buy them with, let that currency be the reward for OW and cursed quests, let ML10 drop the currency and so on, then make a set price on the items and let each encounter and BG quests and so on drop the currency in an amount fitting to the challenge the encounter provide compared to the price of the items, make the currency buyable with BP, make the currency tradeable.

    Sort of like traveling merchants just with a token, new and returning players will have an easier time farming then 1000+ plat.

    A player can now do OW with a druid and pic gear for an alt, a person loving ML10 can collect a group and get items that way, people who purely want to RvR but RvR on multiple chars, can now pool their BP together to buy items for an alt.

    New / returning players can experience what they would like to experience in the game and work on their template at the same time.

    Everyone can progress toward a template in the way they currently would like to, without one way being the road to good rewards, while the other road are the road to crap rewards none can use.

    Sure the idea have flaws, i just grabbed it out of thin air so there will be holes lol, so a calm discussion about things, without people sitting in each their corner holding on to things only they like and enjoy, would be nice and hopefully throw enough ideas around for braodsword to start brewing on a plan to save ywain or atleast stop its loss of players.



    Post edited by Vrisslar on
  • edited January 2019 PM
    PVe: How about you get bounty points from pve encounters as well?

    Make all pve encounters (curse, Ow, ML, artifacts) give various amounts of bounty points depending in difficulty along with the chance to drop all high end items (ow helm, rings, curse stuff (even ch9/10 stuff), DF stuff, etc), with the qty of BPs/item drop chance leveled based ln the diffficulty if the encounter.

    Obviously similar to what was said, just using BPs instead of another currency
    Post edited by Shoke on
  • edited January 2019 PM
    @Shoke

    To me that sounds like a good idea, better then what i suggested, cause it could use the BP crafting system already in place, hopefully saving some work on merchants and tokens.
    Post edited by Vrisslar on
  • edited January 2019 PM
    In case my point wasn't clear, I didn't say Cursed or OW being unachieveable, I was among of people to make Cursed attainable for FG. It's simply the real answer to everything. Sure you can go ahead & farm scales for dragon items, it probably be ok for zerging, but why would any do that just to get gimped gear for more effort.

    Don't get me wrong, I am pretty okay with plats, because I did that mindless stuff many times. Rinse & Repeat. When I returned kind people said it's viable to get my dragon items killing mobs, well did it for a few days, got currency yes, was it smart? No. Now I can stare my 15.000 scale in stash on 3 realms i got free for Christmas from BS wondering why did I farm scales for days previously. Talking about rewarding PvE outside OW and Cursed.
    Post edited by Gavner on
  • edited January 2019 PM
    RonELuvv wrote: »
    The *other* servers are full for other reasons, a fresh start is just one of them. And they won`t be full if a dev team would say * You can play, but we delete all stuff after 3-6 month*. For a player on a classic server is transfering a toon to Ywain exactly that...deleted. They`re not going to play on a ToA-Server.

    But it may be an option for returning+new players that know nothing about *other* servers, yep ok.
    Speculations, speculations....

    Exactly... Speculations!! As a player who played on one of those other servers for a long time I know that most people wanted a reset for what reason again?! Answer: FRESH START! They wanted everyone on equal footing. Thats great, while it lasts for a few months. There is a reason that none of the "other" servers last in the long term, its because as the RR gap increases the population drops. That is a fact.

    They don`t want just a fresh start. The overwhelming majority wants a server with no buffbots, no ToA, realmtimers and a heavy moderation with active gm`s and such. The polls are still there, just take a look what they really want.

    The rr-gap is always a thing...the first players hit lvl 50 after 8-9h while the majority is still leveling. It`s just a matter of invested time....
    Post edited by Stoertebecker on
  • Okay. How about just make a single PvE currency which can be obtained anywhere outside NF or BGs and put up a merchant akin to the BP merchant to buy your end game gear. Done. No need to plat farm or do any encounters.
    "The grab bag isn't for explaining every single class change decision or reasoning or that's all we would ever do." - John_Broadsword
    "The type of of dev communication of 30 mins a day updates mentioned here just isn't feasible." - Carol_Broadsword
    "Our Studio. Our Rules." - http://www.mythicentertainment.com/
  • Don’t know, I would only use one currency for both rve and pve related stuff (BPs). Inwouldn’t make one faster than the other.

    The only thing would be that the stuff from a specific campaign has more chances to drop if you kill bosses from that campaign (aka ch10 gloves drop off cursed stuff).

    This way you use bountycraft (already in place), you don’t have multiple currencies in parallel. Just one currency to rip them all.

    By the way I didn’t invent anything, that’s how it works on the « other side » and i thought it was smart. It would be even better the way Live has implemented BP rvr quests and bountycraft
  • Shoke wrote: »
    Don’t know, I would only use one currency for both rve and pve related stuff (BPs). Inwouldn’t make one faster than the other.

    The only thing would be that the stuff from a specific campaign has more chances to drop if you kill bosses from that campaign (aka ch10 gloves drop off cursed stuff).

    This way you use bountycraft (already in place), you don’t have multiple currencies in parallel. Just one currency to rip them all.

    By the way I didn’t invent anything, that’s how it works on the « other side » and i thought it was smart. It would be even better the way Live has implemented BP rvr quests and bountycraft

    Bountycrafted items would have to be untradeable then. Don't get me wrong, I agree that Market Explorer prices are stupid high. However, if you allow end game gear to be farmed then no one will do the encounters because the prices will drop due to a large supply. This is great if you don't want to spend time/money but perpetuates the problem of a weak community on the PvE side. I personally don't care either way. My time is spent in RvR with the occasional PvE to stock potions.
    "The grab bag isn't for explaining every single class change decision or reasoning or that's all we would ever do." - John_Broadsword
    "The type of of dev communication of 30 mins a day updates mentioned here just isn't feasible." - Carol_Broadsword
    "Our Studio. Our Rules." - http://www.mythicentertainment.com/
  • edited January 2019 PM
    Here we are tho with 200p items just because they seasonable / hard to get for new players who don't know people yet, and I read we have plat shortage. I remember when gold was actually a currency.

    Edit: Stable economy is also a good part being on a new server.
    Post edited by Gavner on
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